« Mennonites and Mammonites...in Paraguay | Main | Industrial Output Graphs »

Apr 17, 2008

Comments

Feed You can follow this conversation by subscribing to the comment feed for this post.

Dennis Sanders

Another good post. I grew up in an evangelical background and left that and immediately embraced progressive politics and pogressive religion until I saw they had their drawbacks as well.

One question. I tend to see myself as an environmentalist, albeit from the center-right. I tend to support ways that we can take care of the Earth better. I was trying to understand your remark that environmentalism has found a home in socialist/communist movements. Can't one be an environmentalist and NOT a socialist?

Michael W. Kruse

"Can't one be an environmentalist and NOT a socialist?"

Absolutely! I'm concerned about environmental issues as well. It is neo-Malthusian environmentalism ("We're exhausting all the resources and must ration them out.") and the “imminent apocalypse” framing that draws in totalitarians. “Global crisis created by evil capitalist means we must have wiser expertocracy run the world economy,” is the reasoning. Sorry if I gave anti-environment vibe.

Steve K.

Michael,

I'm trying not to get hung up on the fact that I think you just called all of us Emergent cohort folks "morons." No, what I'm really wondering is if you can expound a bit further on what you think this "generative cohort economy" could/should look like. Your comment "We need less free church and more fair church" is one that resonates with me.

So I'm just wondering where are we (Emergent/cohorts) going wrong, as you see it? Are we buying too many Brian McLaren/Tony Jones/Doug Pagitt books? Are we too "post-evangelical"? Are we too "post-congregational"? Are these the kinds of things that you're talking about? I'd just love to understand better.

Thanks,
Steve K.

Dennis Sanders

Michael,

Thanks for the explainations. That helps.

Michael W. Kruse

Steve, I wanted you to know I've read your comment but I caught in a bit of a time crunch this afternoon. I'm going to address some of this in a couple of more posts but I try to point to a couple of key things later.

I do want to be clear about the "moron" thing. I think we can speak of many human systems, including both the church and markets, as chaotic entities out of which unplanned order appears. My point was that in the Emergent Church conversation, this reality is granted to the nature of church but not to markets.

So put the question any way you like it:

A. If the market is a moron, then why aren't generative cohorts as a collective a moron?

B. If markets need considerable oversight and managing, why doesn't the church need considerable oversight and managing?

C. If generative cohorts are not moronic, why is the market a moron?

D. If church does not need considerable oversight, why do markets?

Verify your Comment

Previewing your Comment

This is only a preview. Your comment has not yet been posted.

Working...
Your comment could not be posted. Error type:
Your comment has been posted. Post another comment

The letters and numbers you entered did not match the image. Please try again.

As a final step before posting your comment, enter the letters and numbers you see in the image below. This prevents automated programs from posting comments.

Having trouble reading this image? View an alternate.

Working...

Post a comment

Your Information

(Name is required. Email address will not be displayed with the comment.)

Your email address:


Powered by FeedBlitz

Kruse Kronicle on Kindle

Check It Out

Categories